STYLETHREAD -- LET'S TALK SHOP!

Eurodaisy · Dooney & Bourke

RE: Marriage...

Lilykind · Hermes

I've been dating my BF for almost 4 1/2 years. Most of my friends who have been dating their SOs for that long are either engaged or already married. I just feel that since I'm 20, what's my rush?

I do want to get married, but mostly for legal reasons. I do not want to be in a case like Terri Schaivo's and my parents having more legal rights than my BF because I am far closer to my BF than I am to my parents. When I was young, I did want to marry somebody, but it wasn't for the dress and the party...it was because I wanted to find someone who I wanted to make a lifelong commitment with. I figured that if I didn't find that person, I would be OK, but having that person would make my life so much more enriching. I did find my soulmate, though (on the first try, like halleybird), so I look forward to spending my life with him. I already am though...we basically do everything together and function as an old married couple. Getting married is just settling formalities.

I do not want a wedding. Quite frankly, my BF and I have no friends. All the people we'd want at our wedding would be all over the country and we both don't want to make everyone come out to a given place and then essentially go to a party. We hate parties and dirty dancing and too many drunks in the same room and all the silly wedding customs. We've already decided that we're going to get married at City Hall and go out to dinner at a nice nice restaurant. Then we'll blow some on a great honeymoon. Instead of spending tens of thousands at a reception, we'll put a down payment on some real estate...that's an investment that gives back far more than a glorified party, IMO.

I do kind of wish we could get married in NYC. Hedvig's Central Park wedding is basically my dream one from my childhood.

I am changing my last name, but not because I really want to. I love my last name, but it's 16 letters long and no one wants to take the time to pronounce it. It's a source of endless frustration when I try to deal with customer service or the doctors or anything really. But when I take my BF's last name...I'm going to have a very cartoon-character sounding name. I can't win.

(but I also can't control the names of the people I fall in love with).

kenzie · Chanel

This is such an interesting thread. I love reading everyone's responses.

I agree with detroit's perspective, in that, if and when I find someone who I want to spend my life with, I'll marry them b/c it's just easier to function legally as a married coupled than as just living with someone.

That said, I don't want a big wedding, an expensive dress or tons of guests who don't really care that I'm getting married. I would love to just go to Vegas with some close friends and family and just get married there. No crazy planning and stress and for a year and tons of money spent on just one day. Hey, if I regret it later, I can always do a vow renewal ceremony, right?

As for the taking their last name. It really depends. My last name is pretty distinct and I like it (I didn't always feel that way, though). I may take his last name legally, but still use my last name for work and career purposes. It's hard to say without being in the situation, though.

halleybird · Hermes

Elle wrote:

. Honestly, it feels like the decision to have a wedding, aside from the decision to get married, is somewhat of a feminist issue. Not only here necessarily, but in general these days. Almost like people think a truly progressive woman wouldn't/shouldn't want a wedding, and that women who choose to are weak, focusing on the wrong things, frivolous, etc. I think it's interesting that spending alot of money on a wedding is considered an unnecessary expense, and is put into a separate category from other expenses that could be viewed in the same way by our own emotional response to what we think a 'wedding' is. And from someone who is having an expensive, big wedding I too think having a big, expensive wedding that is beyond one's means is totally ridiculous. But not every big, expensive wedding is totally ridiculous, ya know?

I think this is a good point. I don't really like the implication that, if you have a wedding, you're automatically buying into some outdated and commercialized dream. Honestly, I can see why some people see weddings as a waste, but I truly don't find that to be true. I would have been very, very sad if I had not been able to share one of the most important days of my life with my parents, my sisters, my grandma and my friends. My wedding was worth every penny, because it allowed all of the important people in my life to be together at one time, which I found quite miraculous (considering some of them, including my parents, truly dislike one another).

But that was my individual situation, and my choice to make. I completely respect and understand why some people would go to city hall, and some people would go to Vegas, and why some people don't want to marry at all. As scarlett said, feminism is really about choice, and about not judging the choices of others.

Maddie... I did change my last name, and it was a difficult choice for me to make. My maiden name was sort of interesting, and reflected my heritage, while my husband's name is pretty bland Anglo-Saxon. My dad is an only son, and he has no sons, so the name will die out. But I did change it for both symbolic and practical reasons. I like the symbolism of sharing a name, and the idea that we are "The ___ Family." Practically, it is just easier to deal with doctors' offices, insurance agencies, mortgage companies, etc. with one name. Also, being a "Mrs." at work (with teenage boys) is much easier than being a "Ms." or "Miss", sad as that is. I did keep my maiden name as my middle name, and I almost always use the two names together.

Sandy · Kate Spade

This thread is so interesting to me. I've never talked to someone who hasn't wanted to get married; it's fascinating to hear that point of view. I've already responded with what I wanted to say, but I want to answer the last name issue. I definitely want to change my last name to my husband's. Like Elle, I figure that I am starting my new family, and choosing to take a new name demonstrates that. On the other hand, I love, love, love my last name. It shows who I am and where I'm from, so it'll be hard to let go. My family's name is slowly becoming extinct. There are four boys left to pass it on: my cousins. Cousin #1 already has twin 7-year old girls; I think he and his wife are done having kids. Cousin #2 is homosexual, so he won't be having any. Cousin #3 is our only hope, because Cousin #4 is also gay (although he hasn't "come out" yet, we've talked about it). My nephew has a hyphanated name, but that will change... my sister will have it changed to her fiance's name when they marry, or if anyting makes them decide not to marry, she will change it to ours. I don't want my kids' middle names to be my surname, because it just doesn't flow with my bf's surname.

Karina · Chanel

my SO and i have been together 5 years, and as most of you know, we have 2 children. we knew we wanted to be husband and wife before having children, but i didn't get married just because i was pregnant. it wasn't an issue for me at the time. i wanted to make sure i married the man i loved, and not the man that knocked me up. our families tried to push the issue when i was pregnant, but when i put my foot down and told everyone i was not marrying him until i was sure of it, they backed off.

he proposed to me almost 2 years ago, and we've postponed the wedding a bunch of times (i got pregnant again, money issues, etc) .. and the only reason why we are having a big wedding is for his family. i could be totally cool with just living together and never getting married, but it doesn't make sense when we have been living together so long, have 2 children, assets, etc etc.. if God forbid something were to happen and we would split up, i don't want to get fucked over. my mother and father have been together 30+ years and are not married... she is not entitled to anything if they split up.

sephorablue · Marc Jacobs

luckylily wrote:

Maddie wrote: Third question to the mix...Did/would you change your last name? I did not change my last name. My husband and I actually had an interest in having the same name, but we both have last names that make people giggle or ask dumb questions. We considered selecting a new surname, or somehow combining our surnames, but ultimately we couldn't decide on anything so we each kept our own names.

this reminds me of a married couple I know--she was an O'Brien and he was a Cohen and they said they wanted to both jointly change their name to O'Cohen, which I thought was one of the funniest things I ever heard. I think she just took his name in the end though.

joy0302 · Kate Spade

When I was a teenager I thought I would have been the last person to get married at age 24, but like Halleybird I met my guy and knew right away that we would get married. We dated for about 4 years before we did though. As far as a big wedding, we had about 250 people. It was nice to have the people that we are close to and grew up with there. Unfortunately though, I do not have 250 close friends, so alot of what it turned out to be was a drinkfest for his parents friends, many of whom we had never met. I think big weddings are nice if that is what you are into, but if it would have been mine choice (unfortunately with his parents it was not) I would have had only close friends and relatives, not just people there to drink beer.

I think that it is cool though that there are so many different opinions of marriage coming from everyone. It is really interesting to read. Oh also i did change my last name. I just figured it would be easier and less of a hassle.

So i did the whole wedding thing, but after almost 7 years he has yet to talk me into kids. Love them, don't like the idea of being in the hospital pushing one out!!

Liz · Kenneth Cole

Karina wrote:

my SO and i have been together 5 years, and as most of you know, we have 2 children. we knew we wanted to be husband and wife before having children, but i didn't get married just because i was pregnant. it wasn't an issue for me at the time. i wanted to make sure i married the man i loved, and not the man that knocked me up. our families tried to push the issue when i was pregnant, but when i put my foot down and told everyone i was not marrying him until i was sure of it, they backed off.

Karina, you and I are kinda in the same situation. I'm not married yet because I don't feel that it's right for me at this time. My SO and I still have a lot more growing to do in our relationship before I would be ready to tie the knot. Like Detriot said, I only want to get married once. Ideally anyway.

My SO and I have a child together (believe me, I did not plan on having a child with someone before I was ready marry them, but sometimes in life things don't go according to plan). When she was born, I decided to give her his last name for two reasons. No matter what happens, he will always be her father and no matter what doubts I have about us together, I know he will always be there for her. The second was because I think there is a good probability that we will get married in the future and I would like to share the same last name as my husband.

All that being said, if I never wind up being married, whether it be to my SO or to anyone else, I don't think I will feel too badly. However, I think a little part of me will be sad to lose a childhood dream. It's just so funny that I grew up having all these traditional fantasies and goals about how my life would turn out, but I am living the exact opposite of all of them. I guess having things turn out the way they have can have a positive side though. It's taught me to take things as they come and to make the best choices you know how at the time.

needsfashionadvice · Kate Spade

I got married in 2004. I was 24, hubby was 26. We didn't have a wedding, we got married in a backyard that belonged to the Justice of the Peace that was marrying us. I did hire a photographer though because it was a really pretty garden type setting. I changed my name because I'm traditional in that way. It would feel strange to me keeping my maiden name.

blubirde · Chanel

I go back and forth on this issue. In my head there are two voices, one says all the things detroit says and one says all the things brazencanadian says. On one hand, I can see how marriage can be romantic and practical, all in the same boat. On the other hand, I don't see the need for a legally binding contract between me and whomever.

The idea of committing to one person for life scares me, to be honest, even though the boy I'm with now is amazing and I can't see wanting anyone else. Is that wrong? Or weird? I don't know. I don't want to get divorced. I don't want to have to go through that. I understand that you can't predict the future and things change and all that, but still. I also understand that a breakup with a SO, regardless of marriage or not would be extremely difficult. So maybe this is a fear that is unfounded, considering both instances would be incredibly hard.

Weddings scare the bejeezus out of me too. I can't stand wedding stuff. The thought of trying on dresses freaks my shit out. My BFF just got married in October and she did everything in an untraditional way. Even still, the amount of money and planning that went into it was absurd. I couldn't have handled it if it were me. That said, I'd hate to deprive my family of some kind of ceremony where they get to be involved or at least watch. Frankly, no type of wedding ceremony I've ever seen appeals to me. I'm intensely personal so I'm not keen on sharing such intimate thoughts and feelings with people, even family and friends. But, like I said, I know they'd be heartbroken if they weren't involved.

As for changing my name, absolutely not. I love my name. It's part of my identity and there's no way I'd change it. I just don't see the point. If having the same last name is very important to him, he can change his to mine. I highly doubt that will happen, so I suspect, if the time ever arises, we'll have different last names. As for children, again a big "if," I suppose we could cross that bridge when we came to it. Maybe they could have a combo name, or if one of us was adamant about it, they could take that parent's name. I don't know. I'm open to possibilities.

So end results? A big fat, I don't know. It's such a complicated issue, isn't it? It's hard to sort out my feelings vs. pressures put on me by other entities (family, society, friends, etc.). It's hard to know where one starts and the other begins. Maybe as time goes on, things will get clearer and clearer.

I don't think marriage is a feminist issue at all. I'm a feminist and I've never considered the issue something that might clash with my feminist ideals.

sfclinevandy · Coach

I don't even have a boyfriend right now, so marriage isn't really something I think a lot about. BUT, I've already thought about the following things... If I'm not married before the age of 30, I DO NOT want a traditional wedding. I think it's ridiculous to be that age and dictating your friends wear the same dress while I parade as the pretty princess bride in a virginal white veil. But that's just me. I'd rather run off and elope... as I get older that idea grows more and more charming. Also, by the time I do meet a guy and am ready to commit, I will probably be pretty establish in my professional career. I like my last name, it ties me to my family AND I like that it kinda serves as a tribute to my parents who funded and supported me throughout all of my life and education. So I doubt I would change my last name, but never say never.

I think being married makes sense from a basic legal and financial standpoint. For me personally, I get weirded out by the thought of being with one person until I day. That's a LONG time and I just don't know if I could hack that. Who knows, maybe I'll suprise myself.

esquiress · Marc Jacobs

sigh. so many choices! and with every stage of life, it gets a little bit more complicated. at the end of the day, i want the fairy tale wedding and the happily ever after honeymoon. what can i say? some things never change. as for now, i'd be content w/ a boy to like who likes me back. so here's hoping.

kittenheels · Coach

As a newly married person, I enjoy being married, but I do not know that it's right for everyone. As a lawyer, I understand the legal benefits and protections which come with marriage. I think it is unfortunate that these benefits are not available to committed living-together couples, but that might change eventually. I like the idea that I have a partner in all my big adventures like buying a house or having children! As for the name change, I haven't done it yet because I have to change it with social security, the state bar and the 9th circuit. That is too much for me, so I'll be in name limbo for a few more months until I get my act together :)

Chloegirl · BCBG

I'm 25 and have been married five and a half years now (no kids yet). I got married two months before my 20th birthday. I didn't think I'd get married that young, but I always knew I wanted to get married when I found the right person. It just so happens that we found each other during my senior year of high school. After eight years of being together and five years of marriage, I still believe he's the one and though I look back now and think "Wow, I was REALLY young when I got married" I don't regret doing it.

We did have a wedding, though we did only what we could afford to do and had a nice summer wedding in the garden of a local historical home. (The fee for using the house was only $50!) The wedding to me was always about having our family join in the celebration of us commiting ourselves to each other. I did change my name, but it was never a big deal to me whether I did or not. A few months after our marriage I made the name change official just because I thought it would be easier than having to explain for the rest of my life that I go by my maiden name. The name change issue was really not a big deal to me though. I have two brothers to carry on the family name and my dad has four brothers all with the same last name, so we're not in any danger of it dying out just yet.

I love being married and wouldn't change a thing we've done in our lives together.

atlgirl · Gucci

I am married. And I wanted to get married (though I didn't know that until I met my DH). I took his last name. That was a really big thing for him, and I like his last name better than my maiden name anyway. And I wasn't so tied to my maiden name that it would be hard to give it up.

I got married at age 32, so we're coming up on six years this April.

I feel like being married makes me more committed to DH than I maybe was with any other guy. In the past, I was nearly always the one to leave relationships. If I didn't think the relationship was overall good, (i.e. had more good days than bad, or was just constantly painful to me), I'd initiate the breakup. But I stood up in front of our friends and family and made a commitment to DH and I intend to honor it, unless something major - like cheating, or something - causes me to not be able to fulfill that commitment.

-- Edited by atlgirl at 12:36, 2006-02-07

atlgirl · Gucci

If I'm not married before the age of 30, I DO NOT want a traditional wedding. I think it's ridiculous to be that age and dictating your friends wear the same dress while I parade as the pretty princess bride in a virginal white veil.

I don't see what age has to do with it. I was married at age 31 and I had the traditional wedding and wore the traditional gown. You might think it's ridiculous, but it's still each bride's choice to make. I only planned on having one wedding, ever (still do, assuming DH doesn't get other ideas, LOL) and so I wore what I wanted and set it up the way we wanted to.

And it's no't a question of "dictating" to your friends to wear the same dress. As I recall, the bride *asks* the friends to be in the wedding, and of course they can accept or decline as they choose. I believe it's pretty generally understood that if you're in someone's wedding, you probably aren't going to have too much control over what you wear. It's more a gesture of support and friendship than worrying about the clothing choices.

Maddie · Coach

esquiress wrote:

as for now, i'd be content w/ a boy to like who likes me back. so here's hoping.

Amen.

sfclinevandy · Coach

atlgirl wrote:

If I'm not married before the age of 30, I DO NOT want a traditional wedding. I think it's ridiculous to be that age and dictating your friends wear the same dress while I parade as the pretty princess bride in a virginal white veil. I don't see what age has to do with it. I was married at age 31 and I had the traditional wedding and wore the traditional gown. You might think it's ridiculous, but it's still each bride's choice to make. I only planned on having one wedding, ever (still do, assuming DH doesn't get other ideas, LOL) and so I wore what I wanted and set it up the way we wanted to. And it's no't a question of "dictating" to your friends to wear the same dress. As I recall, the bride *asks* the friends to be in the wedding, and of course they can accept or decline as they choose. I believe it's pretty generally understood that if you're in someone's wedding, you probably aren't going to have too much control over what you wear. It's more a gesture of support and friendship than worrying about the clothing choices.

Obviously you have your opinion and I have mine. Like I said, I PERSONALLY would feel ridiculous to be that age and running around in a big bride ensemble. I've already accomplished a lot in my life and I don't consider having a wedding such an accomplishment. And as for bridesmaids being dictated what to wear, I've already seen it too many times regardless of the bride's age. I understand it's everyone's own decision but I would never do that. I could care less what others do or what you did, though I can't help eye rolling at the expense and pagentry of it all.

ranchera20 · Marc Jacobs

I am 16 so not like this will happen anytime soon!

But I really do want to get married and have a family! I would like to keep my last name but I probably would change it...unless its a really bad embarrasing or funny name!

My wedding would be casual. No big dresses or super nice church ceremony. But I would just love to get married outside in front of a BEAUTIFUL view with the wind blowing slightly. My dads coworker got married recently at Hawaii. She wore shorts and a tank top and invited her parents, his parents, brothers and sisters and a couple of close friends. This is something I would do.