STYLETHREAD -- LET'S TALK SHOP!

RyanJ · Coach

RE: grrrr. some people!!

rosie_the_riveter · Gucci

ico wrote:
Once a black guy spit at me b/c I was white.

That's horrible! I can't believe someone would do that, what an a**hole!

Janey831, that sucks and I'm sorry that happened to you. I don't know if you live in the 831 area code but that's where I'm originally from. Everytime I go home to visit my family I hear whispers and comments too. I'm Mexican and my husband is half white half mexican but he looks like he's full white. When the other Mexicans see me with him they always feel the need to make their stupid remarks about me being with a "whiteboy." It does suck and it bothers my husband quite a bit but some people are just stupid and you just have to realize that you're better than them and ignore it.

Cortney1982 · Chanel

One thing I get annoyed about is some people assume that just because you are white, that you are racist. I work a retail job and I always ask photo ID from EVERYBODY who doesn't sign their cards, or the signature is smeared, or worn off. Well, sometimes when I ask somebody, they give me this dirty look like I am just asking because they are not white! One time my sister had an Indian lady complain to the manager because she had asked to see ID when the white woman in front of her wasn't asked. (the other woman used a pin #, no ID required) so she thought she was being targeted and wanted my sis canned.

ico · Dooney & Bourke

lorelei wrote:

I once corrected an English Professor in 2002 because he kept referring to an Asian writer as an "Oriental." He disagreed with me and said that he had friends who were "oriental" who didn't have a problem with that description, that the real issue was mistakenly calling them "chinese" when they were not from China. I gave up trying to explain it to him, but I took another class of his another semester and he did mention "asians" a time or two, so I think he listened to me and researched it himself.

please fogive my silly question (english is not my first language). What is the difference between asian and oriental? We use it interexchangeably (just made up this word, I guess

), b/c Asia is east compared to Europe (oriental means eastern). Can you please explain?

Thanks

RyanJ · Coach

Cortney1982 wrote:

One thing I get annoyed about is some people assume that just because you are white, that you are racist. I work a retail job and I always ask photo ID from EVERYBODY who doesn't sign their cards, or the signature is smeared, or worn off. Well, sometimes when I ask somebody, they give me this dirty look like I am just asking because they are not white! One time my sister had an Indian lady complain to the manager because she had asked to see ID when the white woman in front of her wasn't asked. (the other woman used a pin #, no ID required) so she thought she was being targeted and wanted my sis canned.

It is probably a defense mechanism and out of habit. I have family members that are many different races and just a trip to Best Buy can be full of racism.

ico wrote:

please fogive my silly question (english is not my first language). What is the difference between asian and oriental? We use it interexchangeably (just made up this word, I guess), b/c Asia is east compared to Europe (oriental means eastern). Can you please explain?
Thanks

I have an aunt that is Asian and she jokingly says "Asians are people, Oriental is food" She doesn't get upset when someone calls her Oriental, because she realizes it is a mistake and usually the person is not trying to be derogatory. There is probably more to the difference between Asian and Oriental.

janey831 · Kate Spade

i think that the word 'oriental' itself is not derogatory, i think asians of this generation do not like the term because it was used in a derogatory way years ago, making it politically incorrect. here is what i found on the internet since i did not really know why it became this way:

Though the word "Oriental" itself is neutral, it has come to be thought of as offensive or politically incorrect in the United States because of its connection with nineteeth century attitudes to the East, and the fact that it is a blanket term for an inspecific category of peoples. The term Oriental has come to be associated with an opposition between "East" and "West", where the East was seen as backwards, exotic, and patriarichal, while the West was seen as logical, rational, and more modern. Additionally, many of the universities in Europe that historically offered courses in Oriental Studies were riddled with inaccurate information that clouded the reality of the people the studies referred to. These distorted pictures of Eastern peoples were used to justify colonization of the countries. Some Asian Americans see parallels between the word "Oriental" and "nigger". However, many see it as simply old-fashioned, as many African-Americans see the word "Negro".

ico · Dooney & Bourke

janey831 wrote:

Though the word "Oriental" itself is neutral, it has come to be thought of as offensive or politically incorrect in the United States because of its connection with nineteeth century attitudes to the East, and the fact that it is a blanket term for an inspecific category of peoples. The term Oriental has come to be associated with an opposition between "East" and "West", where the East was seen as backwards, exotic, and patriarichal, while the West was seen as logical, rational, and more modern. Additionally, many of the universities in Europe that historically offered courses in Oriental Studies were riddled with inaccurate information that clouded the reality of the people the studies referred to. These distorted pictures of Eastern peoples were used to justify colonization of the countries. Some Asian Americans see parallels between the word "Oriental" and "nigger". However, many see it as simply old-fashioned, as many African-Americans see the word "Negro".

that's really interesting, esp the part about universities. We have 2 universities that offer "oriental studies" in Italy, and it's the best way to learn the language and culture of eastern countries, and often they offer the possibility to the students to go work in those countries for a while. It is interesting how a word evolves.

The other one, that is called "the n word" in US, comes from the latin, and in italian we use it just to indicate a skin color, no positive or negative feelings attached, but looks like it is very offensive to use it here.

thanks for the information!

exsupahero · Kate Spade

I hate how ignorant some people are. This one time, I had my boyfriend call into a law office to get some issues resolved involving my younger brother (he was somebody's alibi) and the law office said that he would call us back. He said that one of the things he heard from them was "They speak really good English." It's like, um, okay?! We're Asian and my bf isn't but how does one automatically assume that we'll speak with an accent and whatnot just b/c of our name? Or if my brother's friend's family speaks broken English, should that mean we will too? We've never met either so how can they just assume like that?

sephorablue · Marc Jacobs

ico that's a great definition, and it totally synched with my vague feeling as to why it wasn't really appropriate to say "oriental." Because it's true, it evokes associations with the phrase "the Orient," which used to be the proposterous term used for everything on the entire continent of Asia, plus parts of far eastern/southern Europe too.

Interesting, too, how in the US, "Asian" generally means Chinese, Japanese, Korean, or Southeast Asian, whereas people of Middle Eastern or South Asian heritage are described accordingly. I remember being struck when I watched Bend it Like Beckham that Parminder Nagra refers to another South Asian as "Asian." It made me wonder if that word was used there to refer to South Asians.

On a side note, I am occasionally bothered by the way people incessantly refer to all the myriad countries on the continent of Africa as "Africa," as though it were one country in itself as opposed to a continent full of countries. Never mind the fact that Northern Africa is wildly different from sub-saharan Africa. I suppose it's somewhat unavoidable under certain circumstances, though, given that when people refer to "africa" as a whole in public discourse, they are usually doing so in reference to any number of terrible problems which most of the sub-saharan countries seem to have in common. Like Live 8 this weekend, for example... everything I heard was Africa this, Africa that. Never specific countries. But it was all in reference to problems like poverty and disease which are endemic throughout the continent.

honey · Gucci

sephorablue wrote:

On a side note, I am occasionally bothered by the way people incessantly refer to all the myriad countries on the continent of Africa as "Africa," as though it were one country in itself as opposed to a continent full of countries. Never mind the fact that Northern Africa is wildly different from sub-saharan Africa. I suppose it's somewhat unavoidable under certain circumstances, though, given that when people refer to "africa" as a whole in public discourse, they are usually doing so in reference to any number of terrible problems which most of the sub-saharan countries seem to have in common. Like Live 8 this weekend, for example... everything I heard was Africa this, Africa that. Never specific countries. But it was all in reference to problems like poverty and disease which are endemic throughout the continent.

thisi is one of my biggest pet peeves. africa is a huge, diverse country. it gets kind of frustrating b/c while i think it's great to raise awareness about problems in certain parts of africa it inevitably leads most people to think the every african is some faminine ravaged, aids afflicted, indigent. and while i don't mean to make light of the problems of others, that's not my problem nor are those things major problems for people in my country (or even neighborhing countries), though we do have problems.

lynnie · Chanel

honestly, I think a lot of people stay ignorant because they are too scared to ask. For example, I wasn't really sure why Oriental was ignorant (I don't use the term, but I've heard it) but I didn't want to offend anyone by asking. I have a friend who is Korean and his ex-gf was Chinese and he said it created some problems because they were so different in terms of values. He would tell me some of the differences, but I felt uncomfortable talking about it with him because I didn't know these differences beforehand and I didn't want to say something wrong. Everything he told me was new to me, and it made me feel stupid, like I should know this already. It's almost like its just more PC to not talk about it, like race/ethnicity just doesn't exist, becase no one wants to offend anyone. Of course, people just stay ignorant this way. Does anyone else feel similarly?

-- Edited by lynnie at 10:48, 2005-07-07

RyanJ · Coach

lynnie wrote:

It's almost like its just more PC to not talk about it, like race/ethnicity just doesn't exist, becase no one wants to offend anyone. Of course, people just stay ignorant this way. Does anyone else feel similarly?

I totally agree and I hate that. I get so annoyed when people say things like "I don't see black people, white people or asian people. I just see people." I don't see why it is such a bad thing to admit that we are different. That doesn't mean that a certain race is better or worse than another it just means that we are different. Everytime I see my SIL I don't think "Oh, she is Iranian" But I do realize that we have differences.

I am not sure if that is what you meant, but that is just what your post made me think of.