STYLETHREAD -- LET'S TALK SHOP!

brazilian · Dooney & Bourke

Diamond Engagement Rings...

Kitty · Hermes

I have a canary diamond. There are some places that have more of them than others, but the quality of the diamond will depend on the certification, not on the place you buy it from.

I actually based my setting off of a designer setting (looks exactly the same, but isn't signed) and had a small shop make it for me. The designer is: http://www.ajaffe.com/

I think Jaffe has beautiful settings and rings..very timeless.

I also think I benefited a lot from going to a smaller shop. they ended up getting a great deal at a wholesale convention they went to, and we upgraded to a much better diamond, it only cost us about $500, but the diamond alone is worth nearly $6k more than the diamond we were going to originally get from them. They just had us in mind when they went to the convention, and happened to stumble upon a great deal.

Also, we went to the gift center, which is like this MASSIVE diamond-selling place in San Francisco, and we visited about 100 different vendors. You quickly learn what the going rate is, and what's a good deal after you get about 50 quotes.

scarlett · Marc Jacobs

he he, i posted a thread much like this back in october! and have since gotten engaged. congratulations on this fun and exciting news. :)

like you, i knew/know next to nothing about diamonds or how this process is supposed to work. and neither did my fiance. my experience was a little different from yours in that my FH wanted to do all the work and research himself, so i wasn't involved in the shopping aspect. after he'd been saving and looking for a few months, he took me into a zales to show me the kind of design he liked to see if i liked it as well. we also had a couple discussions (initiated by me making seemingly casual yet secretly deliberate and planned remarks) about the kind of metal i like.

ultimately, he got my ring at tiffany's. i actually discouraged him from doing this because i'd heard they jack up the prices, but he liked his experience with their salespeople the best and felt comfortable there.

brazilian · Dooney & Bourke

Kitty, I live in the bay area also and was thinking of going to the gift center. I'm going to check out some local stores to see their selection and prices. BTW I love your ring, that is one of the styles I'm very interested in but am not sure if I want a white diamond or a canary diamond.

Scarlett, what style ring do you have? I was looking at some rings at Tiffany's, but I think for what my BF can afford, I can find a ring of better quality. But I do agree, they have wonderful service.

Thanks girls!

Kitty · Hermes

I didn't realize you're in the bay area!

This is the place I went to for my ring: http://www.wgdiamond.com/

Hermes

brazilian wrote:

I'm not sure if this is the right place...feel free to move it.

My boyfriend has let me know that now that he got promoted he is going to start saving for a ring. I want to look around myself for styles that I like and what would be a reasonable price. If any of you girls know a thing or two about diamonds could you help me out?

1. Would you recommend a chain store or a mom & pop store?
2. Is there anyway to know around how much a particular diamond should cost?
3. Do you have any experience with canary diamonds? Are some places better than others for canary diamonds?
4. Have you ever bought diamond jewelry online? What was your experience? Would you recommend the site?

I might have more questions later. Thanks for any help. I just want to get as much information as I can. Thanks!!!!

-- Edited by brazilian at 18:07, 2007-04-12

I would not go to a jewelry store to buy a diamond. I would try to find a diamond dealer - we have some in the Detroit area - don't know about your area. If there's any chance you'll find yourself in Amsterdam or Antwerp, you'll find your best deal from a cutter/retailer there. Regardless, a diamond retailer/dealer is not the first place I would go for a good deal on a diamond.

Me, I would hop on ebay. I would only consider diamonds from:
~ North American (US and Canada) sellers who have a feedback of at least 500 with 100% positive feedback and offer papers
~ antique rings where you can see the stone clearly and it appears clear and white (doesn't matter what the setting looks like - you can have the diamond reset) Also note that many antique rings have mine cut diamonds, which I actually prefer over modern cut brilliants - they just have a very sparkly organic quality to them. Also consider vintage/antique "european cut" diamonds.

The way to know how much a particular diamond will cost is to educate yourself. There are four variables: cut, color, clarity, and carat weight.

Cut makes a difference in the way light is refracted within the stone (the sparkle) - the better the proportions are to one another, the better the sparkle. The better the cut, the more you pay.

Light Reflection of Diamonds Diamond Anatomy

Color:

Colorless diamonds are rated D, E, or F.

Nearly colorless diamonds are rated G, H, I, or J.

Faintly yellow/brown diamonds are rated K, L, or M.

Very light yellow/brown diamonds are rated N through R.

Light yellow/brown diamonds are rated S through Z.

Don't be fooled by lower quality diamonds marketed as champagne or canary. Many diamonds that are marketed as canary (a.k.a. fancy yellow) are actually an S to Z color which is the least valuable, and thus least costly.

Personally, I wouldn't consider a diamond any higher than I-J in color if you decide to get a white diamond and not a fancy yellow.

If you go with a fancy graded diamond, the grading is as follows (from GIA.edu):
"GIAs D-to-Z color grading system for colorless to light yellow diamonds, is based on the relative absence of color. However, the grading system for a colored diamond is based on the presence of color. Using a controlled viewing and lighting environment and an elaborate set of color comparators, trained graders can consistently locate the characteristic color of a diamond and assign it a grade. The hue chosen is modified by a Fancy-grade term, such as Fancy Light, Fancy, Fancy Intense, Fancy Deep, Fancy Vivid, or Fancy Dark, which describes the range of the combined effect of tone and saturation. Once a color grade is established, the diamond is graded for clarity."

Clarity:
The less inclusions a diamond has the more valuable it is. Also consider diamonds that have inclusions near the girdle - these can be hidden under one of your setting's prongs. I would not consider a diamond any worse than an SI1 (or SI2 depending on where the inclusions are located)

Diamond Clarity Chart


FL, IF	Flawless, Internally Flawless: No internal or external flaws. Internally Flawless: No internal flaws. Very rare and beautiful diamonds.
VVS1, VVS2	Very, Very Slightly Included: Very difficult to see inclusions under 10x magnification. An excellent quality diamond.
VS1, VS2	Very Slightly Included: Inclusions are not typically visible to the unaided eye. Less expensive than the VVS1 or VVS2 grades.
SI1, SI2	Slightly Included: Inclusions are visible under 10x magnification, and may be visible with the unaided eye. A good diamond value.
I1, I2, I3	Included: Blue Nile does not carry diamonds of I-grade clarity.

Carat weight speaks for itself. The bigger the diamond the more it costs.

Back to ebay. Educate yourself. Look at completed items (items that have actually sold) to determine what you can feasibly get for your money.

I searched "diamond" under vintage/antique, then selected "fine" (to weed out reproductions and costume) - then select completed items and sort the prices from high to low and start browsing in your price point.

This sold for $2,200 - .74 ct. center stone, E, VS1, european cut (vintage/antique) .40 side stones.

this one sold for $1,995 - .88 ct., G-H, SI1-2, brilliant cut:

This one for $1,914, 1 ct., F, I1 (see? you can see the inclusions on the lower right quadrant of the diamond) this is also a "transitional cut" a cut that is something between the older mine and european cuts and the modern brilliant.

$1,236, 1 ct. G SI1

Also know that diamonds (mostly those sold as new and not vintage/antique) are often "enhanced." They will heat the diamond to reduce the color, and use fill to reduce the appearance of the inclusions (yehuda.) If you get one on ebay, immediately have it checked out to make sure you were sold what you were told you were buying (approximately - grading can be slightly subjective - but enhanced diamonds when it was not disclosed to you is not acceptable.)

HTH!

-- Edited by D at 10:33, 2007-04-13

-- Edited by D at 10:45, 2007-04-13

jacL · Coach

Wow, D, your diamond tutorial was so helpful!

Hermes

jacL wrote:

Wow, D, your diamond tutorial was so helpful!

oh good! glad I could help. I have been collecting fine jewelry for years and I'm happy to share what I have learned from all the research and exposure I've had to jewelry. If I can help someone get a good deal, then I'm happy!

-- Edited by D at 10:27, 2007-04-13

brazilian · Dooney & Bourke

Thanks for the info D. I have been reading about the 4 C's for a while. I know what I want color (D-F), clarity (VVS-VS), and for the most part carat (~ 1c. tw.) and cut (Brilliant or radiant). I dont know that much about the proportions of the cut though. Do jewelers provide that information (I'm sure its on the GIA cert, but I dont know if you can see that before you buy the piece)? I'm not sure how I feel about getting something online though. Especially for an engagement ring I want it to be something I can try on beforehand, and see the quality IRL. Perhaps if I had previous experience with an online seller I would feel more comfortable. How do you find a diamond dealer? Do they provide settings or do you have to go to a seperate jeweler?

While I love the canary diamonds, I'm still not sure if thats what I really want. I'll just have to look around and see the difference in pricing.

Thanks again D for all the information. If I do get some diamond jewelry online, I know who to come to for help! biggrin

-- Edited by brazilian at 11:53, 2007-04-13

Kitty · Hermes

The GIA certification will have the proportions on it..and you should DEFINITLY see that prior to purchasing.

-- Edited by Kitty at 12:40, 2007-04-13

brazilian · Dooney & Bourke

Have any of you heard of Thediamond.com? I've been looking at their site, and it seems pretty good. I just wasnt sure if anyone had any experience with them or knew if it was legit.

Heres one that I'm looking at: http://www.scheinerdiamonds.com/cgi-local/SoftCart.exe/online-store/scstore/p-01-12PL-181-EA-CST.html?L+scstore+dsfs7903ffdc23dc+1176494087#. The price is the setting and the diamond would be a .93 fancy canary diamond VVS2. (seperate price)

Wanted to add: D have you heard of Diamonds by Lauren? Shes a seller on e-bay and also has her own site. I love this ring that she has. aww

-- Edited by brazilian at 13:18, 2007-04-13

Hermes

brazilian wrote:

Thanks for the info D. I have been reading about the 4 C's for a while. I know what I want color (D-F), clarity (VVS-VS), and for the most part carat (~ 1c. tw.) and cut (Brilliant or radiant). I dont know that much about the proportions of the cut though. Do jewelers provide that information (I'm sure its on the GIA cert, but I dont know if you can see that before you buy the piece)? I'm not sure how I feel about getting something online though. Especially for an engagement ring I want it to be something I can try on beforehand, and see the quality IRL. Perhaps if I had previous experience with an online seller I would feel more comfortable. How do you find a diamond dealer? Do they provide settings or do you have to go to a seperate jeweler?

While I love the canary diamonds, I'm still not sure if thats what I really want. I'll just have to look around and see the difference in pricing.

Thanks again D for all the information. If I do get some diamond jewelry online, I know who to come to for help!

-- Edited by brazilian at 11:53, 2007-04-13

no, I haven't heard of diamonds by lauren - but then i don't buy "new" jewelry on ebay (with the exception of a diamond setting to mount a loose emerald I had in.) anytime i have purchased "new" diamond jewelry, it has never been as described or has been enhanced (and not disclosed.) i actually filed charges on someone in California. That's why I only buy vintage on ebay from perfect sellers. I would only consider buying new on ebay if the seller has tons of perfect feedback.

The way you figure out the proportions is to know what the dimensions are of the diamond - you then bump that up against the chart I pasted (you should certainly be able to see the papers before you buy.)

The diamond dealers in our area do provide settings - some more than others. There's a "diamond exchange" in my area. Also, don't be afraid to ask for the jeweler's best price - standard bartering skills apply here - don't just automatically pay the price they quote.

I googled "san francisco diamond exchange" and found this (you can search more extensively): http://www.sfdiamondexchange.com/ -- they have on-line inventory to search from (including dimensions of the diamonds to determine proportions.)

HTH!