STYLETHREAD -- LET'S TALK SHOP!

Metric · Gucci

so I'm a dating failure

Kelly · Hermes

You definitely didn't do anything wrong! That's ridiculous - admittedly, it's not the smartest thing you ever could have said. But honestly, even thinking that ahead of time probably wouldn't stop me from answering the same exact way as you did. What was he doing, then, asking you? Fishing for compliments? That's just stupid. Plus...what does he think happens at bars? It's not like you said, "All these guys were hitting on me, I got a zillion phone numbers, I even slept with one. They were all pretty hot." You just said that they did hit on you, and that's kind of just assumed if you're going out to bars. That's what happens there.

I think you dodged a bullet with that one. If he can't even handle an innocent answer to a question that he asked, he's crazy. And how crazy jealous would he be when you guys went to bars together or at parties or something? Sounds like he would be one of those guys who gets mad because someone looked at you too long.

Sorry guys are so frustrating

Bastet · Kate Spade

I don't think there are any rules re: the fragile male ego. I think Z was just a whacko and it's probably better you didn't meet him in person if he couldn't handle the fact that you answered his question that way. He's probably one of those overly jealous (and hence insecure) guys. What did he expect you to say, "no, guys never pay attention to me, I was sitting alone in the bar thinking about you"?

cat · Marc Jacobs

Bastet wrote:

What did he expect you to say, "no, guys never pay attention to me, I was sitting alone in the bar thinking about you"?

That made me laugh so hard,I said something like that sarcastically to a guy I was dating once and he got so pissed.

You didn't do anything wrong,the man has issues,and having dated a guy like that once,trust me you really avoided a hassle by having him run off now.

luckylily · Gucci

UGH! He asked! I wonder what he thought was an appropriate response.

That would be a pretty big red flag for me. I have very little tolerance for jealousy, and if he's got this atitude now, I can't even imagine what he'd be like in an actual relationship.

jacL · Coach

No, no, no, you are NOT a dating failure--that guy Z is! Seriously, he sounds like a weirdo and dating is hard...but it can be fun too!

Hopefully the next lucky guy to get your attention is much cooler!

squishy · Coach

there's ego stroking, and then there's birthing, nursing and paying for an ego's rent well into his twenties. no sane woman should be subjected to that.

you are not a dating failure! he (of the fragile male ego) is the failure!

Dizzy · Marc Jacobs

It's not your job to learn how to accomodate his ego. Once you start trying, it will just get worse and worse and worse. Find a guy who has himself in good enough shape that he doesn't need to put you down. (That, my friend is approximately 200 BAD dates worth of advice). I know how it feels. You think you're just being fine and they wig. He's a weirdo. The guy who obsesses over who else wants you is 1) Trying to elevate his own status through "dating up" 2) NEVER going to get over the need to know who else wants you. 3) Going to blame you for any attention you get. So. Not. Fun.

sephorablue · Marc Jacobs

you are not a failure, this guy is an idiot!

blubirde · Chanel

Maybe it's me but I don't think you said anything wrong at all. I wouldn't think twice about saying what you said. Especially if it were true. The red flag for me wouldn't be the jealousy but the anger in having a little shit fit right then and there. Be glad you learned his true colors before you actually had to go through the trouble of meeting him. Ugh. Guys like that are so damn dysfunctional.

Here are my two bits of wisdom about dating: 1) it's feast or famine (not pertinent in this situation but it's always a ton of boys or no boys); and 2) you gotta kiss a lot of frogs, which is especially pertinent in this situation. You're not a dating failure, by any stretch of the imagination, but if you were, you'd still be on your way to finding someone good eventually. If you don't date all the weirdos, then you won't know a non-weirdo when he comes up in front of you.

My own version of your story: I was talking with a guy online (met through a dating service) and we were both watching the same baseball game. I was flirting, I thought he was flirting, and it was a very nice IM conversation, if such things exist. All of a sudden, without warning, he explodes, accusing me of teasing him, not letting him come over, etc., etc., etc. Now I may have been playful with him and maybe it got a little too flirty, but I assure you I was not "teasing" the boy. And I'll be damned if I was letting a crazy person I'd only met online come over to my house. My ass! So that ended that. He hung up on me, IM style, and we never talked again. So if it makes you feel any better, craziness abounds.

Good luck and once again, you're so not a dating failure.

Metric · Gucci

So in a discussion today about this with my bff, she tells me it would probably be in my best interest if I were to not say things to guys that may risk upsetting them, thus increasing my chances to be more "dateable" (not exactly in those words but that was pretty much the gist of the conversation). If I were to work on editing the things that I say or the way that I say them, I could avoid being in such situations.

She figures had I played coy and said something along the lines of "other guys? I was having such a great time with my bff" I would still have a date this weekend. But why would I have done that? This brings up a really interesting sub-topic to me: should you alter your personality, albeit it ever so slightly, in order to get a guy to like you? Should you walk on eggshells around a guy who may get upset? Do you want to be with a guy who you need to walk on eggshells around? Do you act differently around your spouse/SO?

I'm not a delicate girl and I definitely couldn't pull off acting like one. I'm loud, ballsy and opinionated. I have a pretty "big" personality and that was never a problem with my ex (who wasn't lacking in personality himself). Why would I act like Stepford wife to get a guys attention? I figure if a guy is going to like me, it'll be for me the way I am. Because as hard as I try to act like Suzie Homemaker eventually Natalie Ballbreaker is going to slip out. But is there merit in the idea of "being" a certain way for someone? Should you start out being the most pared-down refined version of yourself and let more of your personality grow as you get to know each other? Or do you act like YOU from the first minute and put all your cards on the table?
Thoughts?

scarlett · Marc Jacobs

No no, you definitely don't want a boyfriend who you need to walk on eggshells around! I tried replying before and it didn't go through, but I agree that this guy did you a favor by revealing this side of himself so soon. What he asked you was a silly question, and he got the answer he deserved. It shows he's insecure and would most likely be a jealous or even controlling guy. Anyone who can't take your answer for what it is, which was an innocent comment, is way too needy and fragile. You hadn't even met him yet -- you don't owe him anything. It's also ridiculous that he would be so upset by your answer that he would immediately decide not to see you.

I think we should definitely be ourselves when we're dating, and the guys should be themselves too. Sooner or later, our true personalities reveal themselves, so there's no value in pretending to be someone else, even if that someone else is only a little bit different. If you have to be a different person to get a guy to like you, then he is not the guy for you. I mean, we should show up clean and nicely dressed and ready to make friendly conversation, but we shouldn't feel we need to hide parts of ourselves. Like, if you love the Yankees but hate the Red Sox and go on a date with a Sox fan, you shouldn't pretend to love the Sox. (I live in New York so this seems like a pertinent example.

)

I do think there are certain things best kept for later, like, say, farting in front of each other!

eta: I need to add that you are so awesome as yourself, Metric, that any guy who doesn't jump to go out with you is nuts!

-- Edited by scarlett at 19:07, 2007-02-16

sephorablue · Marc Jacobs

Metric wrote: should you alter your personality, albeit it ever so slightly, in order to get a guy to like you? Should you walk on eggshells around a guy who may get upset? Do you want to be with a guy who you need to walk on eggshells around? Do you act differently around your spouse/SO?

But is there merit in the idea of "being" a certain way for someone? Should you start out being the most pared-down refined version of yourself and let more of your personality grow as you get to know each other? Or do you act like YOU from the first minute and put all your cards on the table?
This will get repetitive:

1. No!
2. No! Who has time?
3. No.
4. NEVER
5. Noooo...
6. Yes! If somebody can't handle who you are at the beginning, they're not going to be able to handle you in the long run, either.

Now, there is definite merit in withholding certain things about yourself that aren't just inherent parts of your personality... I'm thinking about personal history type stuff. Nobody wants to sit down at a first date and hear about their date's recent broken engagement, or toxic parent, or whatever--I think you should definitely take your time revealing your baggage as the relationship progresses.

But the idea of you concealing or modifying your true personality to try to attract a guy is horrifying! You are 100% right and you shouldn't consider listening to your BFF for even a second! I mean, what good is it to have a date if it's with someone you're obviously incompatible with (and by "incompatible with" I mean "a thousand times too cool for.")? I'm honestly astonished that she would even feel like you had missed out on something.

The idea that one should alter one's personality to attract or keep a partner is appalling--and ultimately futile because, as you say, even if you managed to play Suzie Homemaker for a while the real you would eventually emerge, and if that's not who the guy wanted, then you'd both have only been wasting your time.

You are right! Please do not listen to your BFF about anything relating to men or dating, if this is the way she thinks!

scarlett · Marc Jacobs

sephorablue wrote:
Now, there is definite merit in withholding certain things about yourself that aren't just inherent parts of your personality... I'm thinking about personal history type stuff. Nobody wants to sit down at a first date and hear about their date's recent broken engagement, or toxic parent, or whatever--I think you should definitely take your time revealing your baggage as the relationship progresses.

I totally agree with this. And you're right -- please don't listen to your friend on this one!

Deuce · Dooney & Bourke

I feel your pain!! I have a big strong personality too. Some guys can handle it and some cannot. I have developed a sort of taste as to which guys would be able to hang and which would get hurt and or run quickly. Online dating makes this harder because you cannot judge reactions as well and when you have to type you kinda filter yourself.
For what it is worth, I think big personalities are great. You should never really sensor yourself dating. Then they will just run later when you have more invested. If they can't handle it now they won't be able to handle you for years and years. Their loss not yours!

NCshopper · Hermes

Metric wrote:
So in a discussion today about this with my bff, she tells me it would probably be in my best interest if I were to not say things to guys that may risk upsetting them, thus increasing my chances to be more "dateable" (not exactly in those words but that was pretty much the gist of the conversation). If I were to work on editing the things that I say or the way that I say them, I could avoid being in such situations.
I'm sure your bff is a great person, but this is terrible advice. Like all the other girls have said, he's going to see your true colors some day, so you might as well be yourself. Otherwise, you're really just playing games and that never leads to anything productive.

I also agree that you dodged a bullet with this guy. Seriously, if your comment set him off like it did (and FWIW, I see nothing wrong with what you said), then a date with him sounds like it would be a nightmare. You're not desperate, so there's no reason to spend an evening with someone just for the sake of going on a "date" you know?

And, by the way, you are NOT a dating failure.

kenzie · Chanel

Metric wrote:
But is there merit in the idea of "being" a certain way for someone? Should you start out being the most pared-down refined version of yourself and let more of your personality grow as you get to know each other? Or do you act like YOU from the first minute and put all your cards on the table?
Thoughts
___________________________________________________________________________
Always be yourself!!! No matter what, no matter when. If you put up a front in the beginning, it's going to crumble eventually and then the person will see the real you anyway. No use trying to hide it. You are who you are (which is a great, fun, loud person!) and that's okay!! If a guy can't handle it, if he can't handle who you are, then he doesn't deserve you. Move on, move on. You'll find someone who loves you and appreciates you for who you are and that will make all the stupid, spineless men who couldn't handle you before just fade into the background.

Sorry, this is a bit of a soapbox for me. Here's the thing about dating- never settle and always be yourself. I'm also loud and opinionated and kind of goofy, which I like to say is part of my charm.

I would never want to hide any part of my personality from a guy who I could potentially be in a relationship with and I would never want them to hide who they are (I've been on the recieving end of this and it just sucks when you realize that they really are just a nasty burger masquerading as a filet). I just don't know how to do it any other way.

So, no. You are not a dating failure. Z sounds like a paranoid, jealous guy, and someone like you shouldn't be with someone like that anyway. You're too good for the likes of him.

-- Edited by kenzie at 09:57, 2007-02-17

-- Edited by kenzie at 09:57, 2007-02-17

Dizzy · Marc Jacobs

If you'd altered your personality, or tried to play "coy" sure, you'd have a date. With an ass. I think he overreacted to see if you would call and tell him you didn't mean it and try to get him to "forgive" you. It'sa control technique. And you are so much better off without that loser!

AllieGurl · Marc Jacobs

Whats funny is this guy has jealously issues and you arent even dating yet. Good thing you realized it early!!

relrel · Marc Jacobs

Ahh, darling. A dating failure? What does that even mean...wouldn't it be much much worse if you were good at dating? Being good at dating somehow seems to imply that you change your personality around to have wonderful stimulating conversations with a lot of different guys and are always out with a new guy. So, darling, keep failing at dating! That only means that the guys aren't for you! Wow, that was really incoherent! Anyway...my point is that it's not a bad thing to have lots of first/second dates and pre-first date conversations, that only means that you and the guy aren't a good match and you figured that out early. And besides...are you looking to have a new boyfriend? Enjoy the first dates...even the terrible ones! You might get dinner or at least a beer out of it.

But seriously, have you looked in the mirror lately? Even if you are a dating failure, you're smokin'- some guy will overlook your foot-in-mouth disease and fall in love with you!