STYLETHREAD -- LET'S TALK SHOP!

Alegria · Kate Spade

Have I gone completely bonkers? (long)

ayo · Coach

*sigh*...ok this is going to be a bit difficult for me to say..but I want to be honest with you.

I can tell from your emails that you are both really hurting. I hope you don't take anything I say in the wrong ..but from an objective point of view..I really truly believe you need to decided that you are going to either completely forgive him for he's past actions or decide to walk away.

You are holding on to a lot of hurt and even from reading your responses to he's emails..you aren't truly "hearing" what he is saying to you because you haven't dealt with the hurt. I'm in no way saying he is without flaw and completely justified in he's actions. Any type of betrayal in marriage is completely unacceptable, and hard to recover from. However if you in fact hope/want to save your marriage you are going to have to figure out a way to let it go. You can't continue a relationship where trust is missing and you definitely can't truly communicate with each other if you can't find a common ground. Especially if you are both disrespecting each other.

I think you may want to see if you can do some marital counseling. Sometimes having a neutral party to help you talk things through can help each of you truly listen as well as effectively verbally communicate what the issues are.

Lastly I'll say this...staying together for the sake of the kids only works if you are both willing to put in the work to save your marriage. If staying together just means you are living in the same house but you continue to bicker..well..it's best you go your seperate ways. Kids really don't need to see it..and I hope this doesn't sound harsh..it's simply unfair.

Based on this alone I really don't think your marriage is un-salvageable (sp?). I think you really could fix this if both of you are truly committed to doing so.

I really hope all works out for the best for both of you and your boys.

--edited to fix one of my many grammatical errors! Can I blame preggo brain for this one?

-- Edited by ayo at 21:15, 2006-07-24

esquiress · Marc Jacobs

(((((((((((hugs)))))))))))

-- Edited by esquiress at 12:55, 2006-07-26

lynnie · Chanel

omg, i'm so sorry! sometimes i think my parents could be thinking the same things! I can't offer any sage advice from my perspective (not quite 23 and somewhat cynical, but still hopeful and naive), but i do have to say that both of you have to be willing to open up the lines of communication and really re-connect. He has to make the daily effort, and you have to be able to fully forgive, even if you don't forget. You BOTH have to really want to save the relationship- for yourselves- not solely for your kids. Perhaps a counselor can help you through this. Also, while i'm not sure how long you've been together, i know that a lot of the people that stick together til the end (i'm talking married for multiple decades) have rough patches that are often for a few years- eventually it all becomes water under the bridge and can strengthen a couple if you work through the hardships together. but thats assuming you have a strong foundation and both people want the relationship to work. I think a heart to heart in person w/him will be necessary asap.

Alegria · Kate Spade

-- Edited by shpgqueenet at 20:56, 2006-07-25

Dizzy · Marc Jacobs

Big hugs babe.

-- Edited by Dizzy at 10:35, 2006-07-26

atlgirl · Gucci

Oh please, please go to counseling. I think it could really help if you are both open to it. And it could help you, even if he's not open to it. While there seem to be some differeing perspectives in his and your e-mails, it's clear that you both care about each other, that you both are hurting, and that neither really knows what to do to stop that and try to find your way back to loving each other without the pain.

My DH and I have been in counseling since last fall, and while things are by no means perfect now, they are *much* better than they were all of last year. Your communication issues really resonated with me - DH and I have had many of the same types of discussions (w/out having the affair thrown into the mix), and the feeling of issues never getting resolved. Our counselor has been a great help because she seems to be able to "translate" for us the things that I say and he doesn't "get", and vice versa.

It sounds like right now you have a lot of pain and anger - you say you aren't angry to him, but it comes across in your e-mails (which is totally understandable, BTW) and that you haven't let go of that great hurt he's given you. Talking with an impartial third party could be so helpful toward letting you start feeling better and getting to a happier/healthier place, whether that means divorce or the long road to healing the existing relationship.

My heart goes out to you. Please feel free to PM me if you'd like.

ayo · Coach

*big hug* Shpqueenet....

scarlett · Marc Jacobs

I just wrote a long response and my internet crashed before I could post! D'oh.

I am so sorry you're going through this painful situation. When I read about you seeing that text message at your husband's birthday party, I felt sick to my stomach for you. I think we can all imagine how that felt.

You can't continue to be stuck in this limbo -- you sound so hurt and angry in your emails, and that isn't good for you, your marriage, or your children. As wrong as your husband's relationship with his co-worker was, you need to either put that behind you and forgive him, or end the marriage. The marriage can't survive without trust. You and your husband have already been through so much together, and between the lines of those emails you can still see love behind the unhappiness. That means there's hope, I think. I agree that getting counseling is a good next step -- if your husband won't go, then go by youself, but by all means go. Your general physician should be able to recommend one to you. MY BF is in counseling now, and he felt a sense of relief just after making his appointment because he knew he was going to get some help on working through things. I think it could be the same for you.

Lastly, about his friends: I agree with Dizzy that if I were in that situation I wouldn't want to get involved in a friend's marriage either. It doesn't necessarily mean they're covering for him. Keep the focus on you and your husband, make time for him alone -- it sounds like he wants some attention -- and get to work on putting this behind you. Again, counseling should be a tremendous help. Please let us know how things are going!

blubirde · Chanel

First of all, I totally get why you're still angry and hurt and sad. Betrayal (physical or no) is a very hard thing to get over. There's no time limit on when you should stop feeling those feelings. I think your DH doesn't get that. I think he thinks he's apologized enough and now it's time for you to be over it. Imo, he can never be too sorry. That said, I can understand his frustration at not seeing any progress in y'all's relationship (and yours, too).

I really, really think a counselor would be a good idea. Both for you and for your marriage. It doesn't sound like the two of you can talk to each other right now. Every word and encounter has all of this anger and hurt brimming under the surface. Such powerful emotions can make it really difficult to listen to each other.

I also agree with the other girls that you need to decide what you want. Are you willing to work on the marriage? Or do you want to leave? Because it sounds like (in your emails to him) that you want him to make the decision to leave you. If so, and don't take this the wrong way, but that's really unfair. If you want to leave, leave. Don't put the pressure on him to make you happy because you're the only one that can do that.

Imo, it doesn't sound like this relationship is unsalvageable. It sounds like it's something both of you could work on, with help, and if you both want to. I think the help of a marriage counselor would, at the very least, help you both be able to communicate in a way that will be necessary in the future, having children together and knowing you'll have some sort of relationship no matter what.

As for his friends, I can totally understand why you wouldn't want to hang out with them. If you decide to go to counseling, I'm sure the counselor can help you figure out a way to deal with them. If you don't, maybe both of you could agree to try to see each other's point of view and have one night a month (or week or whatever) where you go out with the other's friends. He can go out with you and your friends or sisters and try his hardest to have a good time and you can do the same with his group. I know it would be really hard but it would help show each other that you're both willing to try.

Like esquiress said, I'm not married and I don't have kids, so I could be totally off base in all of my advice. Feel free to ignore if you want. I really hope things get better for you, though, because if nothing else, you don't deserve to be so unhappy.

gingembre1 · Kate Spade

Sigh...The curse of being a woman at times, is that we have memories like an elephant. Meaning, we can bring up incidents from years past in every argument and make it relevant. For some reason we have a much harder time letting things go. What your husband did is extremely hurtful, but to move forward it will take true forgiveness on your part. That means not bringing up his extra-marital relationship every time you argue. I'm not saying it's easy, or that this is what you should definitely do. I think you have some serious thinking to do about whether this is something you can do, and whether you can actually trust him again. If it IS something you think you can do, I suggest MARRIAGE COUNSELING. From the way you two are communicating with each other it sounds to me like you need someone to help you communicate better. I have seen marriage counseling really work for my parents - they can give you great communication tools and also a safe environment to talk about your problems.

Finally, set aside a date night (although I would wait until after the counseling). I know you have two children, but friends and family should be willing to help out if they want you two to succeed. That way you'll have that precious adult alone time, and be able to reconnect outside of your parental obligations and duties.

I wish you all the best... I hope that you're able to work through this, but if, after a truly good faith effort, it ends up being best for you two to go your separate ways, that's okay too.

Alegria · Kate Spade

-- Edited by shpgqueenet at 20:57, 2006-07-25

Sibeski · Dooney & Bourke

I must say "ditto" to everything the other girls said. I don't post very often so I hope you don't think I'm being nosey.

Your husband cannot make you "happy." Nobody can - that is - until you make yourself happy. What do YOU truly want? It sounds like you want freedom and you want your husband to give it to you. If he has never made any decision's it highly unlikely he will start now.

From your last entry it seems marriage counseling is not going to happen. I don't want to say set restrictions, but set goals of a sort. If no marriage counseling w/in a month - done. Try maybe saying 1 thing *nice* (and truly mean it) to each a day.

Again, I hope it's ok I posted. I don't know jack-crap about anything other than what you have posted, and it's a good possiblity I completely interpreted everything wrong. Just please take care of yourself, emotionally and physically. If you don't take care of yourself who will take care of your boys?

My little bro was in a seriously unhealthy relationship for a long time. It got to the point where I couldn't take it anymore. I'm am sooo not a violent person but she was inciting some serious emotions in me. I asked him to list the 5 things in his life that are most important to him. Then right next to those 5 most important things list the ways she supported and/or helped him with these 5 things. He couldn't list anything on the other column. He asked for the ring back. This time she took all his stuff, left her kids toys, bicycles, and beds & went back to Michigan.

Maybe you can try the exercise?

laken1 · Hermes

{{{{hugs}}}}}}

I really don't have anything to say other than what has already been said, but I just wanted you to know that my heart goes out to you.