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Pepper · Kenneth Cole

John Frey on Oprah today about Million Little Pieces controversy

shopgirl · Kenneth Cole

Gawker liveblogged it. I feel really duped because he did lie. I understand that memoirists sometimes take liberty with their recollections, but to deliberately and blatantly lie is something altogether different. In addition to the alcoholism, he's got issues.

He should have marketed the book as fiction or else put in a disclaimer at the front. Of course, he'll bounce back from this. Frey: "I don't feel like I conned you guys."

I read My Friend Leonard, the sequel, just before the maelstrom and I don't think I would have spent the time or energy if I'd known so much of what he'd written wasn't true. I wonder know how much of that book is true.

Deborah

http://www.gawker.com/news/james-frey/james-frey-on-oprah-liveblogging-the-live-feed-150872.php

courtesy of the Chicago Tribune
http://www.chicagotribune.com/entertainment/chi-010626oprah-transcript,1,1495071.story?coll=chi-news-hed

Excerpts from Oprah Winfrey's confrontation with James Frey, from a transcript provided by The Oprah Winfrey Show

Published January 26, 2006, 1:54 PM CST

Winfrey: "I regret that phone call [to the Larry King show]. I made a mistake and I left the impression that the truth does not matter. And I am deeply sorry about that because that is not what I believe. I called in because I love the message of this book and, at the time and every day, I was reading e-mail after e-mail from so many people who have been inspired by it. And I have to say that I allowed that to cloud my judgment. And so to everyone who has challenged me on this issue of truth, you are absolutely right."

***
Winfrey, speaking to Frey: "I have to say it is difficult for me to talk to you because I really feel duped. I feel duped. But more importantly, I feel that you betrayed millions of readers. And I think, you know, it's such a gift to have millions of people to read your work, and that bothers me greatly. And so now as I sit here today, I don't know what is truth and I don't know what isn't."

***

Winfrey: "I read this book as a memoir, and to me, a memoir means it's the truth of your life as you know it to be and not blatant fictionalization. So when I pick up a book and it says it's a memoir, I'm thinking that that is your life. I'm not thinking that's a character....And I sat on this stage back in September and I asked you, you know, lots of questions, and what you conveyed to me and, I think, to millions of other people was that that was all true. That was all true."

Frey: "I made a mistake. I mean, what was true is there was that person. Every one of the people in the book existed....I altered things about all of them."

***

Winfrey: "OK. Let's get back to Lily. Was your description of how she died true?"

Frey: "She committed suicide, yeah."

Winfrey: "She hung herself?"

Frey: "I mean, that was one of the details I altered about her....Because all the way through the book, I altered details about every single one of the characters to render them unidentifiable."

Winfrey: "So how did she die?"

Frey: "She cut her wrists."

Winfrey: "And so hanging is more dramatic than cutting your wrists? Is that why you chose hanging?"

Frey: "I don't think either are more dramatic than either..."

***

Winfrey: "I have been really embarrassed by this and, more importantly, feel that I acted in defense of you and...I was really behind this book because so many people seem to have gotten so much out of it, and I believed in the fact that so many people were. But now, I feel that you conned us all. Do you?"

Frey: "I don't feel like I conned you guys."

-- Edited by shopgirl at 15:34, 2006-01-26

scarlett · Marc Jacobs

I haven't read this book, but I saw a column in the Washington Post last week where the writer said Frey had first attempted to sell this book to publishers as fiction, and not a memoir. So it would seem he was aware from the get-go that this was not a true memoir, yet he was happy to receive attention for it as such. And while I haven't read it, that bugs me.

theotherjess · Chanel

He sounds like a blubbering idiot right now.

member · Hermes

I'm going to watch it tonight. I'm halfway through the book right now and this pisses me off. I don't even want to waste my time reading the rest of it now. He's sounds like a fool.

laken1 · Hermes

I didn't really care either way about this until now that I watched the show - he is such a liar & is still lying. You can tell. And he doesn't have good answers - I have no idea why he agreed to appear on the show again - maybe because the threat of the lawsuit? Idiot!!!!!!!!

You know what? I'd almost have more respect for him if he just said that he lied, it got out of hand & he didn't know how to fix it. Instead he's just....UGH

I keep adding to this because as i watch it i get more & more angry - the publisher is basically saying that it's not their fault because they believed it - they didn't fact check because they believed it? WTF? isn't that their JOB? and if smoking gun could figure out it wasn't true, why couldn't the publishers? because they obviously didn't try.

-- Edited by laken1 at 17:55, 2006-01-26

Maddie · Coach

For some reason I am completely fascinated by this issue. I actually just wrote an article for my school paper about it.

Basically I can understand why everyone who is involved is acting they way they are.

I thought Oprah handled it well. By having him back on the show and addressing the issue she was able to get rid of any embarassment about the issue and kept herself from being brought down with it. She has every right to be infuriated, but she was very calm and brought it full circle to almost forgive Frey in the end.

I thought Nan handled herself really well. She didn't let Oprah tear her apart and didn't sell out Frey. I also think that there hasn't beem much precedent for this, and while yeah, they didn't fact check, I don't think it had ever really occurred to them that was entirely necessary. Obviously a big mistake, but I'm sure it will be remedied. Recently some other "memoirists" have been exposed and I think the publishing industry is recognizing this is a problem. I don't blame Nan, I think things happen.

I also don't blame Frey. If I wrote a roman a clef and was told that if I lied and shopped it as a memoir someone would pubilsh it my answer would be "Hell Yes." One of my dreams in life would be to be a published author (I'm guessing that's something Frey and I share) and I would be totally willing to tell white lies to do so. People were upset about the Frey incident, but the person who was really hurt the most was him. Frey is in no way the only person to do this and some other instances have been a lot worse, he's just the most high profile. I do think he handled the situation poorly. He should've just admitted he was wrong and apologied and explained why he did it. Then no one could go after him anymore. But I can't fault him for doing it in the first place.

In addition - I also understand exactly why Frey embellished. When I wrote my article for the school paper I embellished. I talked about my mom's cousin in it, but referred to him as an uncle because I really have more of an uncle relationship to him and so by referring to him as my uncle it made the point better. I'm not condoning him saying he went to jail or didn't have novocaine when he did, but I understand why little lies would be necessary just to make it read well as a book.

-- Edited by Maddie at 21:00, 2006-01-26

halleybird · Hermes

Maddie wrote:

I also don't blame Frey. If I wrote a roman a clef and was told that if I lied and shopped it as a memoir someone would pubilsh it my answer would be "Hell Yes." One of my dreams in life would be to be a published author (I'm guessing that's something Frey and I share) and I would be totally willing to tell white lies to do so. People were upset about the Frey incident, but the person who was really hurt the most was him. Frey is in no way the only person to do this and some other instances have been a lot worse, he's just the most high profile. I do think he handled the situation poorly. He should've just admitted he was wrong and apologied and explained why he did it. Then no one could go after him anymore. But I can't fault him for doing it in the first place. Edited by Maddie at 21:00, 2006-01-26

Maddie, you know I love you but I totally disagree. One of my life's goals is to be published, too, but I wouldn't intentionally lie to do it. Also, I think what he did was potentially hurtful (especially the part about the girl who supposedly isn't dead).

Additionally, I have deeper societal concerns about the implications of what he's done. In college, I studied the effects of journalists who falsify information, and it really does shake the credibility of the entire genre -- journalism, or in this case, nonfiction writing. When something like this happens, people begin to adopt the attitude of "this might or might not be true." It makes me sad to think about all the future writers whose work may not be taken as seriously because people will wonder if they're the next James Frey. Bottom line, the publisher should have included a disclaimer, i.e. "some events have been fabricated to more accurately portray the author's feelings, etc."

That said, I am reading the book right now, and even if I ignore my feelings about the fake stuff, I find it far less than brilliant. More like egotistical and melodramatic. Meh.

esquiress · Marc Jacobs

ok, i haven't read the book but my best friend did and she gave me an overview before all this hullabaloo and i'm beginning to think she's psychic. because here's what she told me when she first read it:

overhyped

a quick read but not because it was that engrossing, just because it wasn't that long and written in short sentences.

the best parts of the book were when references to other books.

a lot of it read like a cliche

and, drumroll please...

a lot of it didn't ring true and was probably embellished.

however, in spite of those observations, she still felt it was an entertaining read.

but anyway, do i have one perceptive best friend or what?!

esquiress · Marc Jacobs

halleybird wrote:

Maddie wrote: I also don't blame Frey. If I wrote a roman a clef and was told that if I lied and shopped it as a memoir someone would pubilsh it my answer would be "Hell Yes." One of my dreams in life would be to be a published author (I'm guessing that's something Frey and I share) and I would be totally willing to tell white lies to do so. People were upset about the Frey incident, but the person who was really hurt the most was him. Frey is in no way the only person to do this and some other instances have been a lot worse, he's just the most high profile. I do think he handled the situation poorly. He should've just admitted he was wrong and apologied and explained why he did it. Then no one could go after him anymore. But I can't fault him for doing it in the first place. Edited by Maddie at 21:00, 2006-01-26 Maddie, you know I love you but I totally disagree. One of my life's goals is to be published, too, but I wouldn't intentionally lie to do it. Also, I think what he did was potentially hurtful (especially the part about the girl who supposedly isn't dead). Additionally, I have deeper societal concerns about the implications of what he's done. In college, I studied the effects of journalists who falsify information, and it really does shake the credibility of the entire genre -- journalism, or in this case, nonfiction writing. When something like this happens, people begin to adopt the attitude of "this might or might not be true." It makes me sad to think about all the future writers whose work may not be taken as seriously because people will wonder if they're the next James Frey. Bottom line, the publisher should have included a disclaimer, i.e. "some events have been fabricated to more accurately portray the author's feelings, etc." That said, I am reading the book right now, and even if I ignore my feelings about the fake stuff, I find it far less than brilliant. More like egotistical and melodramatic. Meh.

i totally agree. i too would love nothing more than to be published but i would never ever lie about my life and experiences in order to make that happen. if i lied, i'd feel like i betrayed my readers. for example, i know my column is not a big deal at all to anyone but me but i would just feel so...dirty if i lied in it. like if certain people didn't even exist or act the way they did, but i pretended like they did? the whole thing would be a complete fraud! and sure sometimes i worry that i won't have anything to write about or that it won't be as interesting or entertaining as sex and the city or something but you know what? oh, well. in real life, sometimes things are anticlimactic or embarassing or just plain silly but that's the beauty of real life. and i really do feel like frey made a mockery of the whole nonfiction genre by doing what he did.

Maddie · Coach

halleybird wrote:

Maddie, you know I love you but I totally disagree. One of my life's goals is to be published, too, but I wouldn't intentionally lie to do it. Also, I think what he did was potentially hurtful (especially the part about the girl who supposedly isn't dead).
Additionally, I have deeper societal concerns about the implications of what he's done. In college, I studied the effects of journalists who falsify information, and it really does shake the credibility of the entire genre -- journalism, or in this case, nonfiction writing. When something like this happens, people begin to adopt the attitude of "this might or might not be true." It makes me sad to think about all the future writers whose work may not be taken as seriously because people will wonder if they're the next James Frey. Bottom line, the publisher should have included a disclaimer, i.e. "some events have been fabricated to more accurately portray the author's feelings, etc."
That said, I am reading the book right now, and even if I ignore my feelings about the fake stuff, I find it far less than brilliant. More like egotistical and melodramatic. Meh.

Ok, I do think him lying about going to prison is bad, particularly cause it was totally unecessary, and I wouldn't do that, but I don't think that him saying Lily hung herself as opposed to slit her wrists is that big of a deal. Of course a disclaimer would've been better, like Tim O'Brien whom we discussed last time, but ultimately I don't think it's a huge deal and I'm not personally offended. I think his book isn't well written and the only good thing about it was that it was such a shocking story, so I'm not defending him as still being a great author, but I just don't care other than I'm intrigued by the whole issue.

I think particularly in light of other "memoir" writers who have come out, Frey doesn't seem that bad. At least for him, his "essential truth" as he puts it is there. J.T. Leroy was supposedly a sexually ambiguous hooker with AIDS who turned out to be a married couple. Another guy named Nasdijj wrote books about his life on the reservation and was recently exposed to not even be an Indian. Not that makes Frey ok, but it puts it in perspective for me about how his story wasn't outrageously far from his life. One thing that particularly struck me today on Oprah was when he said that he know he seems overly badass in the book, but that's how he saw himself at the time even though it probably wasn't true. It is a memoir and it's different from an autobiography. I would obviously expect a lot more truth from a memoir than Frey has given us, but it is subjective. Though I think I would remember whether I had root canals or not.

scarlett · Marc Jacobs

One of my dreams is to be published someday too, but I would never lie about something and present it as a memoir. I wouldn't lie about *anything* no matter what kind of writing I was doing (unless it was fiction). Clearly both Frey and his publisher are at fault here, IMO. In college, I remember an English teacher telling us when we read an autobiography that we must always be aware of how the writer is trying to present him or herself, and that people will sometimes, intentionally or not, try to present themselves in a better light. To an extent that's human nature, etc., but this guy went further to a point of deliberate deception.

Also, it bothers me even more because it was in Oprah's book club. People are reading this book for inspiration about their lives, they're getting together to talk about it, they're absorbing it into themselves. Oprah picks out a book, and thousands of people rush out to read it. You can't even check Frey's book out of the New York Public Library now because so many people are waiting to read it. And here the guy turns out to be a liar. I feel like the Oprah's book club readers have been made fools of by this guy.

-- Edited by scarlett at 23:56, 2006-01-26

Bastet · Kate Spade

I think Oprah shouldn't have made her initial comment, where she acted like what he did was totally okay. She defended him and basically tried to redefine "memoir." It looked like an attempt to cover her butt. And because of her initial support, she lost some credibility when she withdrew her support.

Winfrey stressed that the book's inspirational narrative was more important than any factual inaccuracies.

"Whether he hit the police officer or didn't hit the police officer is irrelevant to me," she said. "What is relevant is that he was a drug addict who spent years in turmoil, from the time he was 10 years old... And, out of that, stepped out of that history to be the man that he is today, and to take that message to save other people and allow them to save themselves. That's what's important about this book and his story."

http://www.ajc.com/news/content/living/stories/0113lvfrey.html

I think that blasting him on her show made her look a bit hypocritical. I think the second response was the correct response, but the fact that she has completely changed her position makes me wonder which is her actual opinion. I feel like she's responding to the public's outrage, and wonder if she's still in cover-her-butt mode.

laken1 · Hermes

Bastet wrote:

I think that blasting him on her show made her look a bit hypocritical. I think the second response was the correct response, but the fact that she has completely changed her position makes me wonder which is her actual opinion. I feel like she's responding to the public's outrage, and wonder if she's still in cover-her-butt mode.

She said yesterday that her first statement was based on the fact that she spoke with him & the publishers & didn't realize the extent of the discrepencies. I just think she had to make a decision because of course she was being pressed for a statement, but changed her opinion when she found out the full extent of the lies. She was in essence lied to twice. I give her credit for saying she was wrong, which again, I'd have more respect for him if he'd just do the same.

member · Hermes

I was actually a little bothered by the way Oprah handled this on the show. Now, don't get me wrong, I think James Frey deserves to be blasted like he was - he lied about all the important details of the book...I was half way through and everything I read that I was so engrossed in, has been ruined for me, because after watching Oprah last night, I come to find out it was all lies or embellishments, but....Oprah seemed like all she really cared about was her ego and how embarrassed she was. I respect the fact that she said she was wrong for defending him, and I know that she's also upset because he fooled her and all of her book club members, but she just kept going on and on about how embarassing this was for her...that just sort of bothered me.

Then again, James Frey sounded like a complete idiot on Oprah yesterday - he couldn't directly answer any of her questions, which drove me nuts. Oprah: So James, what part of the dentist story was true, did you really have 2 root canals w/out novacaine? James: Uh, uh, to the best of my recollection..uh uh...He's such a LIAR!

I thought Oprah was being hypocritical when she was blasting his publisher saying, how could you read this manuscript and not question some of the things he wrote? Some of it was so unbelievable, how could you not question it? Um, Oprah, you didn't question it after you read it and had him on your show praising the book. She believed everything she read too. Now, since she found out she was lied to, she's saying she can't believe anybody would read it and not question it? WTF!

Pepper · Kenneth Cole

shopchicago33 wrote:

I was actually a little bothered by the way Oprah handled this on the show. Now, don't get me wrong, I think James Frey deserves to be blasted like he was - he lied about all the important details of the book...I was half way through and everything I read that I was so engrossed in, has been ruined for me, because after watching Oprah last night, I come to find out it was all lies or embellishments, but....Oprah seemed like all she really cared about was her ego and how embarrassed she was. I respect the fact that she said she was wrong for defending him, and I know that she's also upset because he fooled her and all of her book club members, but she just kept going on and on about how embarassing this was for her...that just sort of bothered me. Then again, James Frey sounded like a complete idiot on Oprah yesterday - he couldn't directly answer any of her questions, which drove me nuts. Oprah: So James, what part of the dentist story was true, did you really have 2 root canals w/out novacaine? James: Uh, uh, to the best of my recollection..uh uh...He's such a LIAR! I thought Oprah was being hypocritical when she was blasting his publisher saying, how could you read this manuscript and not question some of the things he wrote? Some of it was so unbelievable, how could you not question it? Um, Oprah, you didn't question it after you read it and had him on your show praising the book. She believed everything she read too. Now, since she found out she was lied to, she's saying she can't believe anybody would read it and not question it? WTF!

This is exactly the way I felt about Oprah. She turned me off yesterday and came off super preachy and just so above James Frey for this whole incident. She was just trying to save her face and was so worried about her own reputation. I felt like it was a public onslaught of him. She is supposed to be a humanitarian. I felt like the whole show was to try to belittle him and make him feel very low. I think she should have thought about bringing him on, especially when he mentioned to her before the show if there was a gun in the back. Obviously the guy is feeling pretty bad. O.K. someone lied and embellished a book. He didn't kill someone. I think he got enough lickings from everyone in the media.

Maddie · Coach

I obviously don't think Frey is that bad, but I think Oprah was totally justified. Before she brought the book on she'd been contacted by Hazeldon staffers as well as had doubts herself, but the publishers assured her it was 100% true. This has also been hugely embarassing for her. She had a personal relationship with Frey and he obviously completely lied to her face so I'm sure she felt completely betrayed and used. She was harsh in the beginning, but she also did bring it around at the end and seem at least understanding if not forgiving.

halleybird · Hermes

Maddie wrote:

I think particularly in light of other "memoir" writers who have come out, Frey doesn't seem that bad. At least for him, his "essential truth" as he puts it is there. J.T. Leroy was supposedly a sexually ambiguous hooker with AIDS who turned out to be a married couple. Another guy named Nasdijj wrote books about his life on the reservation and was recently exposed to not even be an Indian. Not that makes Frey ok, but it puts it in perspective for me about how his story wasn't outrageously far from his life.

I agree with this, though I really do think Frey is a scam artist. I hope his $3 million apartment in NYC and his celebrity friends can help him through these trying times.

Anyway, don't forget about "Forrest" Carter, supposedly Native American writer extraordinaire, who turned out to be a KKK member. I loved his book and I was crushed when I found out it was fake (if anyone remembers the other Frey thread, I think this is the author I was trying to remember).

http://www.salon.com/books/feature/2001/12/20/carter/index.html